@Adrian Marceau : well,..i had one idea for his attacks, but he's weak to the type it is,... Flame Claw in Mega-Man 7 he would turn his claws to flame, and attack Mega-Man with them, either straight up slashing, or sending a wave of flames at him.

@ZeroDXZ : I like the idea, and I think it would be cool, but then Slash Man would have two dual-type abilities which isn't very balanced... I know that I'm the one who created them, but sometimes these restrictions are very hard to work with. >_>

@Tobyjoey : I think you bring up some very solid points, Toby, and I'm inclined to agree.

I'll keep Slash Man as a Nature core robot with primarily Nature type moves. Too much Cutter / Swift is redundant and boring, which we want to avoid. We need to make sure his first ability is pure Nature type though, and have either Slash or Claw in its name... this is gonna be hard. I'd like to use his dash attack or that glue-like projectile he uses in the games, but I'm not sure how to make it work with the name format.

Maybe we could replace one of the two words with something else? "Slash" and "Claw" are both cutter-like words so they're a little redundant - maybe "beast" is a good substitute? We could have ___ Beast (which is way more flexible) as a first tier Nature type, and then Slash Beast as his second tier Nature / Cutter type. I'm open to other suggestions though...

I know that focusing on small details like these might seem silly or unnecessary, but naming things has turned out to be a very important and delicate task that must be handled with care. It's very hard to "fix" save files that have references to old file or character names, so changing things in the future might be too late. It was quite a pain fixing spelling errors in the past (like Lightning Facility vs Lighting Facility) and I'm not eager to do that again.

In fact, I may kick myself later, but I'd like to have all the abilities planned out by the time the update is released. Not finished, of course, but named and organized so I don't have to reorganize the database again and we can have a clearer road map of the prototype's eventual "complete" version. I know it's an impossible goal but I want to try anyway.

Anyway, back to Turbo Man, maybe you're right about the Flame Core. He's super fast but being able to produce a wheel of fire definitely suggests Flame core potential but leaving him as Swift would make it very difficult to give Nitro Man a unique spin. I think I'll change him back, as your reasoning is solid and I tend of agree. TheDoc, you have any additional thoughts on this?

Lastly, Turbo Man's abilities (sorry I have to go there). If he's a Flame core his first ability should be Flame and his second should be Flame / Something. We have Scorch Wheel as his official ability, so the other one has to use either "scorch" or "wheel". I think wheel would have made more sense visually, but as a Flame core maybe scorch would be the better option. Scorch Drive? Maybe Scorch Wheel is the single-type tier one and Scorch Drive is the dual-type tier two (flame / swift)? Maybe he only uses pure Flame type abilities?

No rush to reply, and I'm not asking YOU specifically, I'm just putting it out there for you guys to think about while I continue coding away. :P

@TailsMK4 : That's not a bad idea, Tails. I remember how we used to dedicate whole legacy chats to those, so having a thread would make them much more accessible.


@Adrian Marceau : For a Slash Man 1st tier ability, I could easily see the goop attack being formatted for this. It could function like Ice Breath in how it stops opponents from switching. Maybe it would be called "Trap Beast" or "Beast Amber"? Something like that anyway. As for the Scorch Overdrive, it seems like a good way of adding more speed elements without reducing the flame aspect.

@Adrian Marceau : Tobyjoey brings up a good point with Nitro Man adding to the Swift category later on down the road, but have you considered the number of potential FLAME cores even before then? Sword Man, Burner Man, Magma Man, I could go on.

Also, do you find it easier to give Turbo Man an extra Swift move or an extra Flame move? Something like Scorch Drive just sounds really forced due to the hypothetical Flame core. Think about what the main component of that ability would be: the Flame factor or the Swift factor?

All I'm saying is that Turbo Man's core shouldn't be based off of another RMs "potential core" way on down the line. To me, Turbo Man screams Swift, and not only do we need more Swift than Flame, but making Turbo Man Flame-type just seems like you're trying to fit a square peg in a round hole.

P.S: I'm not going to format the core types anymore because it's too much of a pain and Flame looks like Swift anyways :P

As for Slash Man, I'm for giving him Nature abilities (especially because those are relatively needed compared to Cutter abilities), but remember that you aren't limited to fitting the RMs name into the ability. Just look at Thunder Beam, Leaf Shield, Rain Flush, etc. I SUPPOSE you could go through and rename them Elec Beam (ugh), Wood Shield (no wood used in the making of this Wood Shield), and Toad Flush (.....I'll admit I don't really have anything to say to this), but I'd rather keep them the way they are. Time Stopper was understandable because there's an actual Time Man, but other than that it's fine the way it is imo. Maybe something like Beast/Slash Strike? Iunno....it's probably better to identify what you want the ability to do, THEN name it rather than build the ability around the name.

Alright, your casually-late MBM here once again, and I’ve joined the battle to input my opinions on the Slash/Turbo hot-topic. Frankly, I don’t believe in some of the points brought up, but I’ll go into that. If you feel I’m wrong, feel free to type up a post and toss a good argument into my face. Starting up with….

>Spring Man-Yeah, a small little note here, but Thunder Bolt[Or whatever Cloud’s weapon was] never [healed him in the slightest]{support}. In fact, it never powered him up! The T.Bolt, in fact, simply “magnetized” him. In this state, Spring Man would attract Mega Man into his position while he was going on into his patterns. He doesn’t go faster, nor does he go slower. He doesn’t benefit from anything, expect the attracting of Rock to his position. Thus, I would classify Electric, to him, as an Immunity, not an Affinity.

>Turbo Man-First off, I’d argue that he deserves an Affinity to Electric. Unlike Spring Man, he actually does receive a boost in his abilities. He becomes faster by a REMARKABLE rate, making him a much tougher fighter. “he becomes an invincible electric car for a short time if charged with high voltage electricity”(MMKB). In this case, I’d say that Turbo deserves the Electric affinity more than old Spring-head. Second off, I do not agree with the reasoning behind the Flame typing. I might as well go back to 7, and bring up his attack patterns. We all remember the Scorch Wheel, right? Of course. How about the “Crash Drive”? No? Allow to enlighten you. It’s his car-transforming technique, where he’d rush you. Obviously, we need to fix the name[Both because it is terrible and Crash Man exists], but tell me what second-typing you could give this attack? Well, none. On the other hand, Scorch Wheel can easily be Flame and Swift, thus knocking out the T2. “Crash Drive”, on the other hand, isn’t so easy. Would it really make sense to give this a second-typing? I mean, he RUSHES you. Keyword rush, which is how I’d sum up most Swift-attacks. Don’t forget we already have quite a bit of Flame-cores coming up. I know you’re throwing Nitro in my face, but I’ll throw something back….

>Nitro Man-I get it, his stats are comparable to Turbo. However, I don’t agree with the stats. 56 defense? I think there’s something off there[Sorry Brorman, but this is one time I don't agree with you!]. Here, look at this quote. “He is a stunt robot who has appeared in many movies and TV shows”[MMKB]. Look, he’s a stunt person. Question for the people in the class, what do stunt-people have to be? Anyone know? That’s right, durable. He’s clearly good at his job, as it says he’s shown up in many movies and TV shows. That means he can take hits. I mean, if you, as a stunt person, couldn’t perform a stunt and end up breaking your leg, that pretty much means you’re a shoddy stunts-man. I'm sorry for "breaking" your dream :( Well, Nitro isn’t a shoddy amateur; He’s a professional. Even looking at his design, you can see an example of this. He’s short and stout, and he has a huge chest. Usually, short and stout means a bit defensive, at least from the shows I've seen as a kid. Those muscles you see him packing? That's right, he doesn't have any. He's not a buff robot. He does have a huge chest, and that’s usually a symbol of a man[I mean robot] who can take a beating. Look at Ivan Drago in Rocky IV. He’s not Quick Man, who needs to be light-weight to move fast, thus being made out of paper-mache[or Raditz, for anyone who gets the joke]. No, Nitro's wheel does that for him. Nitro just doesn’t scream “high attack” to me. Plus, we really don’t have a [defensive]{defend} Swift robot this far, might be interesting. Thus, Swift Turbo wouldn’t be a problem, since his stats won't be similar.
[Note: In return, his attack should be lowered]

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Two-parter because RPG Posting rules apply to me as well :)

[I'm sorry for the DP! But, RP Posting limits apply to me as well :)]

>Slash Man-Oof, here’s the doozy! Look, I just can’t see him being a Nature core. Nothing about him screams Nature to me. I get it: His field? Yeah, it takes place in a wild area. But, fields aren’t who the Robot is. Take a look at our buddy from MM4, Ring Man. He’s a Cutter-core, right? But his field is Space Simulator, a Space field. That doesn’t mean Ring Man is throwing out Star Barriers and Black Hole Bombs all over the place. While I can see Slash Man throwing up a Leaf Shield, attacks like Search Snake and Hornet Chaser just don’t seem right to me, coming out of him. It’s not like Nature Attacks aren’t projectiles either. I mean, we have bees and snakes coming out to hit the opponent, which isn't close-fighting. Yes, I know about Slash Claw. Why does it have to be his T2 though? It’s extremely simple, and never seemed to be anything like a T2 to me. Out of his other attacks, we have the attack where he lights himself on fire[A Nature-bot going Human Torch?] and where he drops his little sticky embers. Could we classify the Ember Drop as his T2? The attack was basically for him to set the player up in a situation where he could slash him, thus creating a little strategy somehow that we could utilize in some way in MMRPG. However….I will admit that the Nature to Cutter ratio isn’t exactly fair. I’m just throwing out ideas here.

>Cloud Man-Eh, I’d be fine with Electric-attacks just doing normal damage to him. We really don’t get too many bots who are like that, having their type do normal damage to them.

So, there’s my viewpoint. I’m not offending anyone, I’m just giving out my 2₵ on this whole debacle here. I’m not trying to offend anyone, so if you’re writing me an angry letter, I will point you to this sentence. I'm typing this late at night, of course, so I might seem a bit off in some places, but just place it to sleepiness. Frankly, I think all you guys make some good points; I just happen to not agree with them. Opinions are made for challenging on the internet though, so feel free to come at me with everything you got.

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@TheDoc & @MegaBossMan : Well, you both make pretty good points that makes my argument seem null. The ratio between planned flame core robots and swift core robots is about 2:1, and a stat change to Nitro could help create difference between him and Turbo, so now I'm kinda agreeing with swift core Turbo.

@MegaBossMan : I'm sorry, but it seems to me Slash Man makes perfect sense as a nature core. Even when ignoring the stage's influence Slash Man still:
A. Appears to be based off of a wolverine type animal.
B. The amber/goop he drops from the ceiling are supposedly (robo?)dinosaur eggs.
C. Is weak to Freeze Cracker and Turbo Fire, which represents extreme temperature changes hurting part of an ecosystem, or nature.
D. As you addressed at the end of your post, there are 7 total planned cutter core robots, but only 5 planned nature core robots, one of which being a newly created robot. By switching Slash from cutter to nature, those numbers would equal out.

I'm sorry if this came off as antagonizing or attacking, but I am trying to write this as my head starts feeling 10 times heavier than normal, and my eyelids 100 times.

@MegaBossMan : TECHNICALLY, I'd rather have Cloud be Either Electric OR Wind. I would say Electric_Wind, so cloud could use those Dual type elec/wind moves. But, Either way it goes. Slash, yes... He should be nature/cutter, having Nature be the main type. His Weakness could be flame, Or ice, since the stage, You could use Turbo's weapon to burn down the forest, and unlock beat. (In MM7). And in MM7, the weakness was Freeze Man's weapon.
Turbo/Nitro. These 2 are basically Dual core. Turbo is Flame_Swift, Nitro is Vice Versa. So, I dont know.
Spring: Spring could be either Elec_Impact, but i think it's safe to say it's Impact_???. So, Yeah.

@TobyJoey Really, I agree with your Slash ideas. I dont know, turbo is As of right now, i believe Is Flame_Swift.

Now... We're forgetting... Junk, Freeze, Burst, and Shade. Really, First off we have Junk. So, Junk in my opinion should be Impact_Wind, Which is pretty similar to dust, i know. Freeze: Freeze i see as mainly ice. I can't think of a T2 For him, but it'll probably have to have more research. Maybe Freeze_Cutter? Like ice... I know.
Burst: Burst should be Explode_Water. Since, the weapon is explode, and the stage is a water one.
And finally, Shade. Shade is Definitely shadow. I can't really think of a T2 for this one. Maybe a Shadow_Possibly Cutter or Something else???

@Tobyjoey : Well, since you responded to my points, I might as well respond to yours, right? :) So, allow me to get started!

>Slash Man-Once again, I just don’t fully-agree with the Nature typing. However, it’s fair to say that Slash Man isn’t exactly a Cutter core either. Cutter-cores are usually ranged-fighters, which is something Slash Man has proven he’s not. However, Nature-Cores aren’t exactly close-fighters too, as they rely on some form of nature, such as leaves, snakes, and bees. Also, Nature-cores are usually more reserved and less outspoken, from robots like Wood Man and Snake Man. Slash Man has proven he is none of that, from sources like Gigamix and such.
1.Well, technically, he’s apparently based on Pluto. That doesn’t mean he should be a space core though, right? I understand your point though.
2.0_0….Those were robo-dinosaur eggs? Aaaaand that changes my perspective on Slash Man.
3. Didn’t notice he was weak to Scorch Wheel as well. Thought that the Freeze Cracker was due to the dinosaur-motif of his, but Scorch Wheel proves me wrong. Then again, Burst is….Never mind.
4.Yeah, can’t exactly argue with my own point. The ratio is pretty unbalanced, and you’re completely right in that regard.

Yeah, you guys make some good points, and I guess I’ll have to go for it. I’m fine with Slash Man becoming a Nature-core. Yes, that's right, I'm all for making Slash Man a [Nature]{nature core}.....Which doesn't make sense since I made an entire post revolving on why he shouldn't. Oh well.

Since MM&B 8-bit sprites are needed, I found some pretty good 8-bit sprites for it along with some 8-bit music. http://www23.atwiki.jp/rockmanforte/pages/22.html (the music) http://www23.atwiki.jp/rockmanforte/pages/14.html (Mini boss spirtes?) http://www23.atwiki.jp/rockmanforte/pages/15.html (Robot master spirtes.) http://www23.atwiki.jp/rockmanforte/pages/13.html (Normal emeny spirtes?) http://www23.atwiki.jp/rockmanforte/pages/20.html (Megaman & Bass+side charters and weapon spirtes.) And now...BONUS Spirtes! http://www23.atwiki.jp/rockmanforte/pages/18.html

@MegaBossMan : I was about to rant on MegaBossMan's points on Slash Man, but then he agreed so this is awkward.... Regarding Turbo Man & Spring Man's relation to Electric, though:

1.) Turbo Man does indeed benefit from Electric just like Spring Man, and the basis of giving him an affinity to Electric is because his benefit is "more" significant than Spring Man's, but instead of arguing semantics, let's step back for a second and consider how aff and imm have been decided thus far. Take (the majority of) the Flame cores: those with Flame affinities are because adding Flame to Flame just results in a bigger flame. Same with Elec Man and Plug Man, only with Electric. When you consider a car getting struck with electricity, however, we know that cars don't get supercharged when, say, hit by lightning. Yes, they're immune to it (people have been inside cars when lightning hits it and been completely safe), but the car itself doesn't benefit from it. This is the epitome of an immunity.

2.) The problem then is what do we do with Spring Man? I would give Spring an affinity to Electric (although this suggestion isn't nearly as strong because you could potentially use my previous argument to oppose this). The reason why being is that, unlike the entirely of the car, the entirety of the spring is made of metal, which conducts electricity. Instead of simply getting hit and being unaffectedlike the car, the electricity in a sense becomes part of the spring. The question now is that does this count as an "affinity", because even though the spring is now electrified, it may not necessarily "power up" the spring.

Feel free to rail on these arguments (especially the 2nd :P ); I just prefer not having two affinities or immunities to the same type in the same generation. If push comes to shove it's not a biggie. Affinities and immunities are enough of the same nature to not worry about sweating the small stuff.

Quick thing I noticed: Snake Man is resistant to Missile, which cancels out the super-effectiveness of Needle Cannon against him. I would suggest that this be changed, either by removing the Missile res or by switching his weakness to Missile and removing Cutter from his attributes. (Keep in mind that making Cutter a weakness leaves that robot very vulnerable to super-effective shots, what with the number of Cutter abilities, so I would follow up with another res.)

Alright, time to get something out of the way: I'd like Turbo Man to be Swift Core. You could argue that flame core is better, but he's a RACECAR robot! His Scorch Wheel is even Swift Type, along with Flame!

@rotomslashblast : Hilariously enough, we just debated that over the last two pages of this thread. Adrian hasn't confirmed anything yet, but I personally agree that he should be Swift.

@TheDoc : And now for another argument! While I do agree with the changing of the resistance to Missile, I don’t believe that should be his weakness. Look at it this way, it makes much more sense(at least, to me) for Snake Man to be hit by Cutter attacks rather then a missile attack like Dive Missile blamming up straight in his face. Even if you don’t agree with that logic, there’s still the matter of Magnet Man being a huge player in Mega Man 3. And while you can argue that Bright Man is technically weak to Ring Man’s Ring Boomerang, that’s more his T2 being Space_Cutter. I’d propose keeping the Cutter-core option, and removing the missile resistance for something else….Maybe Shadow? Snake Man, canonically, seems to be always keen on surprising opponents and keeping to the shadows, not fighting them directly. Thus, he probably wouldn’t be startled by surprise attacks, and he already has a connection to Shadow, being his upcoming Poison Snake T2. That’d mean Shadow Man wouldn’t do so hot against him, but that isn’t a huge problem, right? Let me know if you have any objections or better ideas?

P.S-On the note of weaknesses, I’m not too big a fan of Strike Man being weak to flame. I don’t recall anything special between baseballs and fire, and Solar Man IS a boss in MM10. The only thing I can think of is him being weak to Impact, seeing as we don’t have TOO many bots weak to their own type. The reasoning behind this is because the main objective of Baseball is to strike the ball way up...In other words, flying, meaning that Wind might work too? Someone could argue Swift too, as another major part of Baseball is running to the bases, but something like that would feel more fit at home as a T2 for him. I mean, he does have an attack where he curls up in a ball and flings himself at the opponent, and I don’t recall any Impact_swift attacks….

@MegaBossMan : Argument #1: I was actually pretty indifferent as to which way to go, but your first point alone made sense to me: Snake Man isn't weak to missiles as much as cutting attacks. Ya lost me with the Shadow Man thing, though :P

Argument #2: If anything, Strike Man should have an immunity to Impact (haven't checked the database for other MM10 immunities, though, so correct me if there's a problem) for the exact argument you have for its weakness. Baseballs can be whacked as hard as you want and still be 100% fine; in fact, they have a whole game made around that simple fact. I don't understand why Impact would be a weakness.

I guess if you want to change the weakness from Flame (which makes sense; I don't really see a baseball being weak to flames), you could say.....ummmm.......Nature, maybe? My only reason for saying this would be that baseballs can be hit into forests or other plant life and just abandoned, never to be seen again until it decays into whatever baseballs decay into. Tell me if that's too much of a stretch...

Also, hate to burst your bubble, but Rebound Striker is set to be Impact/Swift :|

@TheDoc : Argument #1: And that's why I was asking to see if anyone had something better :) I know it doesn't make too much sense, that Shadow thing....Snake's on bad terms with Hard Man, right? Plus, I would never imagine a hard-hitting attack would work too well on a snake, much too coily and slithery...Then again, that doesn't make too much sense either. There aren't really any types that match up with something a Snake could resist, so the whole Snake-motif thing he has won't really provide any help....He's good buddies with Toad Man, right? Maybe Water-Yeah, no, forget it. If all else fails, we could just give him one resistance.

Argument #2: "Baseballs can be whacked as hard as you want and still be 100% fine" I don't know what type of Baseballs you had as a child, but it is clear that we did not have the same brand of Baseball :P Anyway, I could go for the Nature resistance. I dunno why, but it always just felt to me that Strike Man[and baseballs in general, of course] were a bit more manufactured, which would obviously go against the idea of Nature. Yeah, I'm fine with a Nature resistance.

@MegaBossMan : Argument #2: Wait, resistance? I thought we were discussing weaknesses? I was saying that Impact would be an immunity and Nature a weakness, but like I said, the Nature weakness was a bit of a stretch...

MAN IDK ANY WEAKNESSES FOR A BASEBALL. *sigh*

....Actually, maybe we can use this to make Strike Man unique. What if he only had the Cutter Weakness? In return, he would only have one resistance as well, this being the current resistance Electric (lol CURRENT resistance see what I did there? :D ). This way, he's less vulnerable to elements and less protected from them, too. The average robot is more affected by element with two weaknesses and/or two resistances. I would say you could even potentially scrap the Electric resistance, but Cutter is too common of an element to do that. Whaddya think?

I'll talk about Tengu Man! Personally, Tengu should be Cutter_Wind or Wind_Cutter. Tornado hold may be his T2 (Wind_cutter) And His Normal move could have him send a wave of wind? His weakness would be... Welp, Whatever move he was weak to in MM8, Or ground.